Comments on: Predestination http://kyleberg.com/2008/06/24/predestination/ Photographer, Writer & More Thu, 06 May 2010 11:24:31 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Kyle http://kyleberg.com/2008/06/24/predestination/comment-page-1/#comment-264 Kyle Thu, 26 Jun 2008 05:28:58 +0000 http://kyleberg.com/?p=529#comment-264 It would be interesting to discuss it with you. My thoughts right now aren't really on the issue of predestination, and maybe that was a poor title. I only use that as an example. My main thought was that we got to this earth somehow and the One who put us here is greater than we are. Creation came from somewhere and we certainly didn't do it. That means we don't get to call the shots, as I think we too often do individually and in modern church. Makes my head hurt just trying to imagine it all, but good discussion nonetheless. I will be out of town this weekend for a rodeo, believe it or not. You might be able to catch me tomorrow night or Friday though. Que duermas bien. It would be interesting to discuss it with you. My thoughts right now aren’t really on the issue of predestination, and maybe that was a poor title. I only use that as an example. My main thought was that we got to this earth somehow and the One who put us here is greater than we are. Creation came from somewhere and we certainly didn’t do it. That means we don’t get to call the shots, as I think we too often do individually and in modern church. Makes my head hurt just trying to imagine it all, but good discussion nonetheless.

I will be out of town this weekend for a rodeo, believe it or not. You might be able to catch me tomorrow night or Friday though. Que duermas bien.

]]> By: Pablo http://kyleberg.com/2008/06/24/predestination/comment-page-1/#comment-263 Pablo Thu, 26 Jun 2008 02:38:08 +0000 http://kyleberg.com/?p=529#comment-263 Kyle-blo, we will need some time to discuss this. Even though I agree with you that God is God and what we think about Him, whether it be Calvinistic, Arminian, or Open Theism, it doesn't change His nature. However, I will vehemently disagree with you on many levels for many reasons. God is love. He's not 80% love and 20% judgment. He is PERFECTLY revealed in the person of Jesus Christ. Christ on Calvary is the perfect image of God. I'm not saying he doesn't have the power to do what he wants, because he does. However, everything he does is out of his character, which is love. To love means to have trust, which requires freedom. If he's already decided what will happen in the future, we really don't have a choice. Look at all the examples in the Bible of God changing his mind - when he was talking w/ Abraham about Sodom and Gomorrah and how many righteous people required to spare the city, Moses pleading with God to not destroy the Israelites, etc... There are also many times of God expressing regret: Israel refusing to enter into a loving relationship with him; Jesus lamenting over Jerusalem. Why would he do these things (and record them in the Bible) if he wasn't sincere about them? I believe a God who knows all the "maybes" of our future decisions and can still bring about his purposes is a much more powerful, creative, trusting, and daring God than one who can't deviate from a predestined storyline. Anyway, I would love to discuss this with you because it has been at the center of much of my thought and study for the last 2 years. Love you. Kyle-blo, we will need some time to discuss this. Even though I agree with you that God is God and what we think about Him, whether it be Calvinistic, Arminian, or Open Theism, it doesn’t change His nature. However, I will vehemently disagree with you on many levels for many reasons. God is love. He’s not 80% love and 20% judgment. He is PERFECTLY revealed in the person of Jesus Christ. Christ on Calvary is the perfect image of God. I’m not saying he doesn’t have the power to do what he wants, because he does. However, everything he does is out of his character, which is love.

To love means to have trust, which requires freedom. If he’s already decided what will happen in the future, we really don’t have a choice. Look at all the examples in the Bible of God changing his mind – when he was talking w/ Abraham about Sodom and Gomorrah and how many righteous people required to spare the city, Moses pleading with God to not destroy the Israelites, etc… There are also many times of God expressing regret: Israel refusing to enter into a loving relationship with him; Jesus lamenting over Jerusalem. Why would he do these things (and record them in the Bible) if he wasn’t sincere about them?

I believe a God who knows all the “maybes” of our future decisions and can still bring about his purposes is a much more powerful, creative, trusting, and daring God than one who can’t deviate from a predestined storyline.

Anyway, I would love to discuss this with you because it has been at the center of much of my thought and study for the last 2 years.

Love you.

]]> By: Matt B. http://kyleberg.com/2008/06/24/predestination/comment-page-1/#comment-261 Matt B. Tue, 24 Jun 2008 19:21:19 +0000 http://kyleberg.com/?p=529#comment-261 Wow, no matter what that is a very God-centered, biblical view of God. I have listened to Matt Chandler for years (Mark is a bit arrogant for me), and whether or not the Calvinist view is completely correct or not, I fully appreciate his willingness to speak truth without reservation. Any "Calvinist" who doesn't preach the absolute necessity of missions, repentance, prayer, etc, doesn't understand what they say they believe. Thank you for your late-night "rant." Wow, no matter what that is a very God-centered, biblical view of God. I have listened to Matt Chandler for years (Mark is a bit arrogant for me), and whether or not the Calvinist view is completely correct or not, I fully appreciate his willingness to speak truth without reservation. Any “Calvinist” who doesn’t preach the absolute necessity of missions, repentance, prayer, etc, doesn’t understand what they say they believe. Thank you for your late-night “rant.”

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